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Quote: Originally Posted by db Alright, you link to one example that proves man-induced global warming, with only data, no models, no "if CO2 increases this amount, temp should increase this amount". Just proof that the planet is warmer now, compared to say... the 1930's or the Medieval warm period.... and that it is man's activity causing the increased temperature. Science doesn't work in complete proof, it...

Quote: Originally Posted by Hershal The current trend appears to be cooling, not warming (see my last post where I put links), and that seemed to be what was happening in the 1970s. Remember the articles about the coming ice age? There simply is no evidence to support the contention that "[t]he current trend appears to be cooling..." As for your links, I will repeat that science is not done by amateurs on advocacy websites....

Quote: Originally Posted by Dimitri I am a Christian, however after being raised both as a Greek Orthadox and a Catholic (as well standing in various other denominations form time to time on Sundays) I realized that maybe .001% of all Christians are good Christians. To be a good Christian you need to be Jew, and how many Christians can say they are good Jews as well? How many Christians actually know what the Torah says? Cause the Churches...

Quote: Originally Posted by Tim Folkerts -that the changes in CO2 and CH4 are predicted to have noticeable changes. This point is the one where you will not gain agreement.

Quote: Originally Posted by Tim Folkerts Greenhouse gases have been observed to raise temperatures on earth and Venus. Actually, we don't know it was greenhouse gasses. We also know the temp on Mars has increased. What is causing their greenhouse gas increase? Or, could it be more evidence that solar influences are at work? Greenhouse gas temp increase can be repeated in experiements.... but only if feedback mechanisms are removed. That...

Quote: Originally Posted by Hershal As for the e-mails, it suggests a group of folks that appeared to be engaging in unethical practices, which does not affect the climate change. It does however effect the notion of climate change. Seeing as they are largely responsible for a lot of the "facts" behind what the media likes to talk about. That is man made global warming. So although irrelevant in the real sense, that the...

Quote: Originally Posted by True Position The denialists are being denied access to prestigious journals via the vast global warming conspracy. The emails speak for themselves.

Quote: Originally Posted by bobdoering But, not only that, we have had more than enough discussion concerning the validity of journal articles in the Cove to begin with. They really need to be treated as academic, but never treated as factual. You can get published with elegant statistics applied to ridiculous samples. Add to that the politics to get published (and keep your academic job and funding) and consider that with the results. So,...

Quote: Originally Posted by db Actually, we don't know it was greenhouse gasses. We also know the temp on Mars has increased. What is causing their greenhouse gas increase? I'd love a citation on Mars global warming. From what I have seen, this change is 1) at the south pole, not global and 2) within expected variations. Besides, I'm not talking about short-term changes - on the order of decades or even centuries. We DO know...

Wow! Lots of good arguments and evidence and speculation over the last dozen pages! It has been stated here that science does not work on proof; that is correct. For a theory to be proven "true" it must be able to rule out any scientific challenge or similar validity from any competing theory. Hence, nothing is ever quite "true", it is just that other possibilities at the time cannot be determined to viable...